Register :: Log in :: Profile :: Mail   


Crime and Punishment: What's the purpose?

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    LVC Home // Liberals Versus Conservatives
Author Message
PeaceLoveandRockNRoll
Known Associate
Known Associate


Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 300
Location: Richmond, IN

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 9:00 am    Post subject: Crime and Punishment: What's the purpose? Reply with quote
Something mulch posted in the "Define Conservatism" thread made me think about issues involving how we treat criminals in society. I figured I'd throw my opinion out there and see what you all think.

I feel that the purpose of the criminal justice system should be the protection of society from forces trying to work against it. I think in most cases, jail time is necessary only for offenders who pose some danger to others- the purpose of it should be isolation of violent criminals, smugglers, robbers, etc. from their potential victims. The primary purpose of prison would be to rehabilitate those for whom it's possible, so they can be let out quickly and become functioning members of society who no longer threaten the wellbeing of others. "Punishment" and "revenge" should not, in my opinion, be a part of the criminal justice system, and I don't think hurting anyone for the sake of peace and justice is necessary in such a system. Thus there would be no death penalty, and life terms would be only for those murderers, sex offenders, and other dangerous criminals who can't be reliably rehabilitated and will always be unsafe to let out of prison. In cases of direct financial offense, a fine should be paid by the offender to the victim in the amount stolen or vandalized. In some of those offenses, of course, it would appear that the offender was likely to reoffend, and he or she should be jailed until such a time as this could be changed. Illegal drugs that tend to cause serious addiction and therefore crime should remain illegal, and prison terms should apply to anyone distributing or smuggling such substances, and to users only in cases where addiction or other issues caused them to be dangerous to others. Drugs like marijuana that do not cause physical dependence and violent crime should be legalized but controlled in terms of potentially dangerous behavior the same way alcohol is (ie laws against DUI). Thoughts?
Back to top
chevydriver1123
Known Associate
Known Associate


Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Posts: 464
Location: Newburgh New York

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The punishment should fit the crime.
Back to top
Turk
Known Associate
Known Associate


Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Posts: 331

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The goal is to punsih crime through procedural due process.
Back to top
Lester
Forum Elder
Forum Elder


Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 3907

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I concur with PL&R, punishment does not solve the problem, I for one never let things like punishment get in my way of repeating an activity that I feel was right.

I would like to relate it to cancer, you may hack away at it, and remove it from the body, but without chemo treatment it'll just come back, perhaps even worse the next time, because you can't be certain you'll get every cell.
Back to top
mulch
Newbie


Joined: 28 Dec 2006
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
When my daughter does something wrong I first tell her what she did wrong and then she gets punished. Grounding, no TV and rarely a swat or 2 on the butt.

She knows this and accepts it.

Why is it that it works for a 9 year old but an adult fails to see how simple it really is?

The "crininal justice" system in the US is completly and totally messed up.

No longer are criminals punished. We have a revolving door for a prison gate. No longer are criminals rehabilitated. In and out. God help us if they are grouped in too close and they don't get enough TV. OH poor slimeballs that the food isn't up to your standards. OH poo hoo!

If the death penality was carried out quickly then that alone would scare many away from crime. When I was growing up my dad believed in copral punishment. One summer I though it was so cool to throw a rock through our living room window. When my dad found out he blistered my butt. Ya know what? I never threw another rock through the window.. OH GOSH GEE how simple do you need it?

Why would a person rape steal and kill instead of work? Simple they are lazy and feel they are more important than anyone else. They put their "rights" in front of the basic right to life of everyone and anything they come across. They have to learn that if you screw up you will be punished. Murder is murder. The punishment should be death.

Rape is wrong no matter what the woman was wearing. The punishment should be death.

Killing someone while driving drunk should be punished with death. No one put a gun to your head for getting drunk, no one put a gun to your head when you got behind the wheel. We get told morning noon and night that drunk driving is wrong. Now we just need to punish those who ignore right and wrong.
Back to top
Lester
Forum Elder
Forum Elder


Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 3907

PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Totally disagree, your 9 year old daughter may accept punishment now and not do that thing again, but just wait until she gets older, once I had a party when my parents went away and they made me pay 500 bucks to charity because some of their stuff got stolen, that is a completely fair punishment, it's almost an eye for an eye, but would I go on to have other parties when my parents were away? Yes. Would them grounding me affect me at all? No. They could ban tv and computer however much they bloody want it's still not stopping me from going on. Once they banned me from the computer after 10:30 and took the cord that connects the computer screen and the box, what did i do? I waited until they were asleep and then grabbed the cord from their computer and used that, then replaced it so they never knew.

Moral of the story? Punishment doesn't work if the person thinks they are in the right, in fact, it makes them more and more determined. The difference between your nine year old daughter and society at large is that society at large has realised that sometimes daddy and mommy are incapable of doing anything.
Back to top
Cowboys_From_Hell
Newbie


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2007 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think anyone convicted of rape, murder, pedophilia, or burglary should be exucuted immediately. And I would be damn glad to do it. Our criminal system is fucked up and we treat criminals better than our citizens. Those kind of people do not have the right to live and polute our world. And prison sentences should be tougher. Gun Control activists frequently whine about how guns cause crime, but at the same time they want weaker sentences for violent criminals, which happen to be the cause of crime. Guns dont kill people, people kill people.
Back to top
Rochester
Newbie


Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 46

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Cowboys_From_Hell wrote:
I think anyone convicted of rape, murder, pedophilia, or burglary should be exucuted immediately. And I would be damn glad to do it. Our criminal system is fucked up and we treat criminals better than our citizens. Those kind of people do not have the right to live and polute our world. And prison sentences should be tougher.


See this is why I'm against the death penalty. I think that being locked in a room for the rest of my life and being raped almost everyday is far worse that simply being killed. Also being in prison is not a picnic I have a cousin who works in corrections and trust me the stories he tells Shocked

and if you are really concerned that we are treating our prisoners better (after everything I just told you) than our citizens maybe we should focus more on making the citizens life better.
Back to top
exton
Forum Elder
Forum Elder


Joined: 13 Dec 2006
Posts: 2825

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 3:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Cowboys_From_Hell wrote:
I think anyone convicted of rape, murder, pedophilia, or burglary should be exucuted immediately.


Why?

Quote:

And I would be damn glad to do it. Our criminal system is fucked up and we treat criminals better than our citizens.


Oh, yeah, i forgot how we lock up our law-abiding citizens in concrete buildings.

Or not.

Quote:

Those kind of people do not have the right to live and polute our world. And prison sentences should be tougher.


Tougher=?

Quote:

Gun Control activists frequently whine about how guns cause crime,


I've never heard anyone say that guns cause crime.

Quote:

but at the same time they want weaker sentences for violent criminals, which happen to be the cause of crime. Guns dont kill people, people kill people.


And uh, who are the people suggesting "weaker" sentences for violent offenders, what qualifies as "weaker", and why?
Back to top
PeaceLoveandRockNRoll
Known Associate
Known Associate


Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 300
Location: Richmond, IN

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Most of your arguments are revolving around hurting people who hurt you. The logical extension is that instead of a parking ticket, you just get beaten to death with a ball peen hammer. After all, then nobody would violate any laws. But is this justice? Does killing people make us safer than locking them up? Mulch has a point that the current system doesn't effectively rehabilitate criminals, and I think that needs to be addressed. Someone who proves himself dangerous has to be made not dangerous if at all possible, and imprisoned until such a time as release is safe. Then effort has to be made through halfway houses and other solutions to prevent reoffending just because the prisoner has become uncomfortable running his own life. An incurable sex offender or murderer or whoever may well have to be locked up until the end of his/her natural life. But if it's possible to pacify an offender, do we as a society have the right to kill them for our own convenience or personal desire for revenge? All it does is breed a culture of violence and promote the idea that some people deserve to be hurt or killed. This can only perpetuate violent crime.

And on a side note, what about crimes against the self? Suicide, drug use, etc?
Back to top
exton
Forum Elder
Forum Elder


Joined: 13 Dec 2006
Posts: 2825

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
PeaceLoveandRockNRoll wrote:

And on a side note, what about crimes against the self? Suicide, drug use, etc?


There shouldn't be any laws against such things. If a person wants to do something that ultimately ends badly for them, so be it. It should only be when they actually harm others that they are in violation of the law.
Back to top
Post new topic   Reply to topic    LVC Home // Liberals Versus Conservatives All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
Add to My Yahoo!

Politics Blogs - Blog Top Sites