Register :: Log in :: Profile :: Mail   
1000's of harp seal pups are dead in canada!

Home // Liberal Corner



Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic
Author Message
Some Chick
Not a Newbie
Not a Newbie


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 136
Location: EARTH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:41 pm    Post subject: 1000's of harp seal pups are dead in canada! Reply with quote
Global Warming Disaster as Thousands of Harp Seal Pups Perish:
Experts Call for Annual Seal Hunt to Be Cancelled


Wednesday 28 March 2007

Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island - Thousands of harp seal pups are assumed dead in Canada's Gulf of St. Lawrence due to the lack of ice floes, which mother seals require to give birth and nurse their pups successfully. Experts with IFAW (International Fund for Animal Welfare - www.ifaw.org) have been carrying out daily surveillance flights over the region. They report that the Gulf of St. Lawrence, which is the annual birthing ground of hundreds of thousands of harp seals, is essentially devoid of both ice and seals.

"The conditions this year are disastrous. I've surveyed this region for six years and I haven't seen anything like this." said Sheryl Fink, a senior researcher with IFAW. "There is wide open water and almost no seals. I only saw a handful of adult harp seals and even fewer pups, where normally we should be seeing thousands and thousands of seals."

The ice conditions this year are among the worst on record. Scientists have recorded below average ice conditions in the Gulf of St. Lawrence and off Newfoundland for the past nine out of 11 years. In 2002, 75 percent of harp seal pups born in the Gulf died due to lack of ice before the hunt even began. This year, the ice conditions appear to be even worse than in 2002 and scientists with IFAW are concerned that pup mortality will be extremely high.

"It's highly likely that this year we could have close to 100 percent pup mortality in the Gulf of St. Lawrence due to the poor ice conditions caused by rising temperatures," said Dr. David Lavigne, IFAW's science advisor, who recently co-authored a report on the impacts of global warming on harp seals.

Experts with Canada's Department of Fisheries and Oceans (DFO), which monitors the harp seal population and sets targets for annual commercial seal hunt in Canada, have also acknowledged the increase in seal pup mortality this year. It is cited as one reason why the Canadian government has yet to announce the total allowable catch (TAC) or official start date of the this year's hunt, which is due to begin any day.

"It would be reckless for the government to allow the hunt to proceed this year, given the high pup mortality that has apparently occurred," said Fink. "We may not be able to save these seals from the effects of global warming, but the Canadian government can save the survivors from being hunted. I can only hope that they will do the right thing and cancel the hunt."

The Canadian government has permitted nearly one million seals to be killed in the past three years. The government quotas have continually exceeded the number of seals that can be safely removed without causing the population to decline. Last year, the TAC was set at 335,000 seals (far above the estimated sustainable level of 250,000) and the total number of seals reported killed was over 354,000 - exceeding the legal limit by 19,000 animals. Of the 354,000 seals killed last year, 98 percent were under three months of age.
Sad
Back to top
TrespassersW
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 988
Location: North Carolina, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
"I only saw a handful of adult harp seals and even fewer pups, where normally we should be seeing thousands and thousands of seals."

This report doesn't add up for me. If there are only a handful of adults where there are normally thousands, isn't it possible that the missing adults have birthed their pups elsewhere? It certainly defies logic to suggest that a handful of adults have had thousands of pups; all of which drowned.
Back to top
Some Chick
Not a Newbie
Not a Newbie


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 136
Location: EARTH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
TrespassersW wrote:
Quote:
"I only saw a handful of adult harp seals and even fewer pups, where normally we should be seeing thousands and thousands of seals."

This report doesn't add up for me. If there are only a handful of adults where there are normally thousands, isn't it possible that the missing adults have birthed their pups elsewhere? It certainly defies logic to suggest that a handful of adults have had thousands of pups; all of which drowned.


It says there are only a handful of adults left. That's the point there should be 1000's of seals. There were 354,000 killed last year.
Back to top
Some Chick
Not a Newbie
Not a Newbie


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 136
Location: EARTH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
354,000 killed just last year, all the pups drowning in the water beacause there's no ice. We're left with just a handful of adults
Back to top
TrespassersW
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 988
Location: North Carolina, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Some Chick wrote:
TrespassersW wrote:
Quote:
"I only saw a handful of adult harp seals and even fewer pups, where normally we should be seeing thousands and thousands of seals."

This report doesn't add up for me. If there are only a handful of adults where there are normally thousands, isn't it possible that the missing adults have birthed their pups elsewhere? It certainly defies logic to suggest that a handful of adults have had thousands of pups; all of which drowned.

It says there are only a handful of adults left. That's the point there should be 1000's of seals.

With respect, that is not what they wrote. What they wrote was that there were only a handful seen; that does not mean that they know where the rest of them are. Adult seals do not simply drown; they are aquatic mammals.

Some Chick wrote:
There were 354,000 killed last year.

And there will be 270,000 killed this year, out of an estimated population of 5.8 MILLION. (I assume you mean killed by hunters.)
Back to top
TrespassersW
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 988
Location: North Carolina, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Some Chick wrote:
354,000 killed just last year, all the pups drowning in the water beacause there's no ice. We're left with just a handful of adults

The adults may not be there, but that doesn't mean they are nowhere. And the notion that thousands of pups drowned does not seem to be supported by the information we have been given. In order for those thousands of pups to drown, thousands of mothers would have to be there--to be seen by the researchers who claimed to see only a handful. Logically, those adults are elsewhere, and it may well be that they and their pups are there too.

I am not suggesting that I know what is true here, I'm just raising some legitimate questions about the report you offered.
Back to top
Some Chick
Not a Newbie
Not a Newbie


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 136
Location: EARTH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
TrespassersW wrote:
Some Chick wrote:
TrespassersW wrote:
Quote:
"I only saw a handful of adult harp seals and even fewer pups, where normally we should be seeing thousands and thousands of seals."

This report doesn't add up for me. If there are only a handful of adults where there are normally thousands, isn't it possible that the missing adults have birthed their pups elsewhere? It certainly defies logic to suggest that a handful of adults have had thousands of pups; all of which drowned.

It says there are only a handful of adults left. That's the point there should be 1000's of seals.

With respect, that is not what they wrote. What they wrote was that there were only a handful seen; that does not mean that they know where the rest of them are. Adult seals do not simply drown; they are aquatic mammals.

Some Chick wrote:
There were 354,000 killed last year.

And there will be 270,000 killed this year, out of an estimated population of 5.8 MILLION. (I assume you mean killed by hunters.)



Oh good, 270,000 is a lot better than 354,000 seals killed. great. Likely to see a 100% mortality rate in pups? even better!
not only are they being taken out by drowning because there's no god damn sea ice for them but they're also being hunted by the 100,000's.


Back to top
Some Chick
Not a Newbie
Not a Newbie


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 136
Location: EARTH

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
TrespassersW wrote:
Some Chick wrote:
354,000 killed just last year, all the pups drowning in the water beacause there's no ice. We're left with just a handful of adults

The adults may not be there, but that doesn't mean they are nowhere. And the notion that thousands of pups drowned does not seem to be supported by the information we have been given. In order for those thousands of pups to drown, thousands of mothers would have to be there--to be seen by the researchers who claimed to see only a handful. Logically, those adults are elsewhere, and it may well be that they and their pups are there too.

I am not suggesting that I know what is true here, I'm just raising some legitimate questions about the report you offered.





It clearly states that 75% of pups born there died in 2002 from lack of ice.

If 1000's of seals were born there and then died, yes, they would have probably seen them.

If 1000's of seals were born there and then moved somewhere else, wouldn't they have seen that too?
The article claims they are doing daliy surveillance flights over the area. 100's of 1000's of seals moving across the ocean should be visible in an area that is patrolled daily specifically to study seals.

Hell I don't know excatly what happened to the seals, but they're not there anymore, they're being killed off by the tons and now they don't have a place to give birth and nurse their babies.

I'm still outraged.

And thanks for your input.
Back to top
TrespassersW
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 988
Location: North Carolina, USA

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Some Chick wrote:
Oh good, 270,000 is a lot better than 354,000 seals killed. great. Likely to see a 100% mortality rate in pups? even better!
not only are they being taken out by drowning because there's no god damn sea ice for them but they're also being hunted by the 100,000's.

I get the feeling that you don't want to learn anything that could temper your righteous indignation over this issue, but just in case, let me share a couple more things I've learned in the past couple of days (just by taking the time to become better informed than one hyperbole-laced "news" piece would leave me)...

1) Pups are protected by law; only mature adults are hunted.

2) The population of Harp Seals in the North Atlantic has TRIPLED since the 1970's; this fact flies in the face of the continuous complaints that controlled hunting is endangering the species.

3) (And I'm making this point for the third time now...) If thousands of mother seals gave birth to pups in the open water, as the article suggests, where were these full-grown, adult seals when the researchers were looking for them? (I don't know the answer, but it sure seems like a good question to me.)

I respect your feelings about this, but I am inclined to think that you can't really do anything about an issue if you've failed to properly understand it first. Most of the information about the harp seal issue is slanted either for or against hunting; I think it is important to recognize that and read things like the article you cited (and others that paint a rosier picture) with a skeptical eye.
Back to top
Some Chick
Not a Newbie
Not a Newbie


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 136
Location: EARTH

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
TrespassersW wrote:
Some Chick wrote:
Oh good, 270,000 is a lot better than 354,000 seals killed. great. Likely to see a 100% mortality rate in pups? even better!
not only are they being taken out by drowning because there's no god damn sea ice for them but they're also being hunted by the 100,000's.

I get the feeling that you don't want to learn anything that could temper your righteous indignation over this issue, but just in case, let me share a couple more things I've learned in the past couple of days (just by taking the time to become better informed than one hyperbole-laced "news" piece would leave me)...

1) Pups are protected by law; only mature adults are hunted.

2) The population of Harp Seals in the North Atlantic has TRIPLED since the 1970's; this fact flies in the face of the continuous complaints that controlled hunting is endangering the species.

3) (And I'm making this point for the third time now...) If thousands of mother seals gave birth to pups in the open water, as the article suggests, where were these full-grown, adult seals when the researchers were looking for them? (I don't know the answer, but it sure seems like a good question to me.)

I respect your feelings about this, but I am inclined to think that you can't really do anything about an issue if you've failed to properly understand it first. Most of the information about the harp seal issue is slanted either for or against hunting; I think it is important to recognize that and read things like the article you cited (and others that paint a rosier picture) with a skeptical eye.




HAHAHA I posted this article because I was concerned about the seals and I think that it's wrong to continue hunting them especially when they are in fact drowning from lack of sea ice. Now, I didn't do the research and write the article or anything, and I'm not scientist, you got me there, but the main thing that I am concerned about is the number of seals that are dying and/or being killed. AND I think more research needs to be done so we can LEARN more about what's happening to them.

Back to top
Docsmitter
Known Associate
Known Associate


Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 311
Location: CA LE FOR NYE YAY

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 3:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Are you telling me that a few thousand seals can't find a patch of ice out of the thousands of acres of sea ice...????
Back to top
TrespassersW
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 988
Location: North Carolina, USA

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Some Chick wrote:
HAHAHA I posted this article because I was concerned about the seals and I think that it's wrong to continue hunting them especially when they are in fact drowning from lack of sea ice. Now, I didn't do the research and write the article or anything, and I'm not scientist, you got me there, but the main thing that I am concerned about is the number of seals that are dying and/or being killed. AND I think more research needs to be done so we can LEARN more about what's happening to them.

I guess I just find it a bit strange that you or anyone would be so worried about a species whose numbers have tripled in the last thirty years and the hunting of which is more closely regulated today than at any point in its past. In fact, it seems like there's a lot to be optimistic about where these animals are concerned, but that presumes that you first want to see the positive as well as the negative.
Back to top
Lester
Forum Elder
Forum Elder


Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 4650

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Docsmitter wrote:
Are you telling me that a few thousand seals can't find a patch of ice out of the thousands of acres of sea ice...????


Well they can, but I think the problem is a patch of ice isn't really gonna cut it for a thousand seals, it's not that there isn't space for them, it's just that there isn't enough space for all of them.
Back to top
Turk
Forum Elder
Forum Elder


Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Posts: 3338

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:01 am    Post subject: Re: 1000's of harp seal pups are dead in canada! Reply with quote
Some Chick wrote:
Global Warming Disaster as Thousands of Harp Seal Pups Perish:
Experts Call for Annual Seal Hunt to Be Cancelled


Wednesday 28 March 2007

Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island - Thousands of harp seal pups are assumed dead in Canada's Gulf of St. Lawrence due to the lack of ice floes, which mother seals require to give birth and nurse their pups successfully. Experts with IFAW (International Fund for Animal Welfare - www.ifaw.org) have been carrying out daily surveillance flights over the region. They report that the Gulf of St. Lawrence, which is the annual birthing ground of hundreds of thousands of harp seals, is essentially devoid of both ice and seals.

"The conditions this year are disastrous. I've surveyed this region for six years and I haven't seen anything like this." said Sheryl Fink, a senior researcher with IFAW. "There is wide open water and almost no seals. I only saw a handful of adult harp seals and even fewer pups, where normally we should be seeing thousands and thousands of seals."

The ice conditions this year are among the worst on record. Scientists have recorded below average ice conditions in the Gulf of St. Lawrence and off Newfoundland for the past nine out of 11 years. In 2002, 75 percent of harp seal pups born in the Gulf died due to lack of ice before the hunt even began. This year, the ice conditions appear to be even worse than in 2002 and scientists with IFAW are concerned that pup mortality will be extremely high.

"It's highly likely that this year we could have close to 100 percent pup mortality in the Gulf of St. Lawrence due to the poor ice conditions caused by rising temperatures," said Dr. David Lavigne, IFAW's science advisor, who recently co-authored a report on the impacts of global warming on harp seals.

Experts with Canada's Department of Fisheries and Oceans (DFO), which monitors the harp seal population and sets targets for annual commercial seal hunt in Canada, have also acknowledged the increase in seal pup mortality this year. It is cited as one reason why the Canadian government has yet to announce the total allowable catch (TAC) or official start date of the this year's hunt, which is due to begin any day.

"It would be reckless for the government to allow the hunt to proceed this year, given the high pup mortality that has apparently occurred," said Fink. "We may not be able to save these seals from the effects of global warming, but the Canadian government can save the survivors from being hunted. I can only hope that they will do the right thing and cancel the hunt."

The Canadian government has permitted nearly one million seals to be killed in the past three years. The government quotas have continually exceeded the number of seals that can be safely removed without causing the population to decline. Last year, the TAC was set at 335,000 seals (far above the estimated sustainable level of 250,000) and the total number of seals reported killed was over 354,000 - exceeding the legal limit by 19,000 animals. Of the 354,000 seals killed last year, 98 percent were under three months of age.
Sad
sounds like bullshit
Back to top
fellfire
Forum Elder
Forum Elder


Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 2021
Location: Washington DC

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 5:09 pm    Post subject: Re: 1000's of harp seal pups are dead in canada! Reply with quote
Turk wrote:
Some Chick wrote:
Global Warming Disaster as Thousands of Harp Seal Pups Perish:
Experts Call for Annual Seal Hunt to Be Cancelled


Wednesday 28 March 2007

Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island - Thousands of harp seal pups are assumed dead in Canada's Gulf of St. Lawrence due to the lack of ice floes, which mother seals require to give birth and nurse their pups successfully. Experts with IFAW (International Fund for Animal Welfare - www.ifaw.org) have been carrying out daily surveillance flights over the region. They report that the Gulf of St. Lawrence, which is the annual birthing ground of hundreds of thousands of harp seals, is essentially devoid of both ice and seals.

"The conditions this year are disastrous. I've surveyed this region for six years and I haven't seen anything like this." said Sheryl Fink, a senior researcher with IFAW. "There is wide open water and almost no seals. I only saw a handful of adult harp seals and even fewer pups, where normally we should be seeing thousands and thousands of seals."

The ice conditions this year are among the worst on record. Scientists have recorded below average ice conditions in the Gulf of St. Lawrence and off Newfoundland for the past nine out of 11 years. In 2002, 75 percent of harp seal pups born in the Gulf died due to lack of ice before the hunt even began. This year, the ice conditions appear to be even worse than in 2002 and scientists with IFAW are concerned that pup mortality will be extremely high.

"It's highly likely that this year we could have close to 100 percent pup mortality in the Gulf of St. Lawrence due to the poor ice conditions caused by rising temperatures," said Dr. David Lavigne, IFAW's science advisor, who recently co-authored a report on the impacts of global warming on harp seals.

Experts with Canada's Department of Fisheries and Oceans (DFO), which monitors the harp seal population and sets targets for annual commercial seal hunt in Canada, have also acknowledged the increase in seal pup mortality this year. It is cited as one reason why the Canadian government has yet to announce the total allowable catch (TAC) or official start date of the this year's hunt, which is due to begin any day.

"It would be reckless for the government to allow the hunt to proceed this year, given the high pup mortality that has apparently occurred," said Fink. "We may not be able to save these seals from the effects of global warming, but the Canadian government can save the survivors from being hunted. I can only hope that they will do the right thing and cancel the hunt."

The Canadian government has permitted nearly one million seals to be killed in the past three years. The government quotas have continually exceeded the number of seals that can be safely removed without causing the population to decline. Last year, the TAC was set at 335,000 seals (far above the estimated sustainable level of 250,000) and the total number of seals reported killed was over 354,000 - exceeding the legal limit by 19,000 animals. Of the 354,000 seals killed last year, 98 percent were under three months of age.
Sad
sounds like bullshit


That's an insightful analysis, I will put it up there with "CFR Scumbags" and "Free market and bank reform are the answer".
Back to top


Post new topic   Reply to topic   Quick Reply    LVC Home // Liberal Corner All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

Add to My Yahoo! Add to Google

Politics Blogs - Blog Top Sites Politics Blogs Politics
Politics blogs Politics blogs Article Directory Political Blogs - BlogCatalog Blog Directory Top Blog Sites